Cannot change into gears, only with engine off ???

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JNijst
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Cannot change into gears, only with engine off ???

Post by JNijst »

Gents,

Due to circumstances I could not run my Pinz for 6 months. Charged batteries and engine is running OK. BUT while engine is running; I cannot get her into any gears, but when engine is off, I can easily change into all gears...

I had this problem a long time ago, also when rested for a few months, but after putting it in first gear and driving it forward a yard or so, it went OK after that and since then no problems, until now. I can of course try to do the same, but I am interested if anybody can point out the problem causing this and before I do damage
Maybe it is stuck on the clutch and needs prying off while battery-driving it in first gear... Just praying it won't be one of THOSE problems, where you need to replace parts in the clutch area...

Thanks for any replies and best regards,

A desparate Jules
Pinz of rock - 710M / 1975 (Austrian Army)
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VinceAtReal4x4s
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Re: Cannot change into gears, only with engine off ???

Post by VinceAtReal4x4s »

Your plate is likely stuck temporarily due to moisture in the air when parked. Try starting it while already in first gear. Low range might help. Just be sure you have room since it will jerk forward. The clutch plate just needs nudged loose.
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undysworld
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Re: Cannot change into gears, only with engine off ???

Post by undysworld »

I know of one truck which has had this issue regularly. I too found that by starting up the truck, it usually freed the stuck clutch. When the truck began moving, I pumped the clutch pedal several times and at some point things acted normally.

One time, even this treatment didn't budge the clutch. So I put down some 4x4s crosswise and drove up and down over them to induce some shocks into the drivetrain.
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63rover
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Re: Cannot change into gears, only with engine off ???

Post by 63rover »

You will never break a clutch free in 1st gear or in low range. The load, effort needed to turn the wheels is too low. With the truck off and the parking brake released select 4th gear, hold the clutch pedal down (engaged) and try starting it. Be certain to have nothing in front of the truck even though there is little chance it will move. The brake is released so that there is not a solid impact to the drive line and helps to reduce the chance of failure. If this is not successful in 1-3 tries it will be necessary to remove, clean and possibly replace the clutch.

I have an old Land Rover that is prone to sticky clutch after winter storage. This routine has worked every time so far.

Good Luck!

Cheers, Clive
JNijst
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Re: Cannot change into gears, only with engine off ???

Post by JNijst »

Thanks a million guys ! What a great site this is.

It is just like having friends, that help you with your car problems.
I will try later in the day, when I have time, but due to the explanations; I now know the problem and will start the Pinz every 2 weeks, no matter what to prevent this from happening again.

Bless you all !

Best regards,

Jules
Pinz of rock - 710M / 1975 (Austrian Army)
63rover
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Re: Cannot change into gears, only with engine off ???

Post by 63rover »

Let us know how you make out. Good luck!
JNijst
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Re: Cannot change into gears, only with engine off ???

Post by JNijst »

Yes I will, but again; it has been delayed by a week - busy, busy - , but I will let you know !

Best regards,

Jules
Pinz of rock - 710M / 1975 (Austrian Army)
JNijst
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Re: Cannot change into gears, only with engine off ???

Post by JNijst »

Well fellow Pinz lovers, it did not work... tried today

I managed to get it running in first gear, but no matter how much I pumped the clutch; it would not budge and it is still stuck ... Oh poop, it must be rusted solid.
I tried in 1st and 2nd gear; start, then it jumps forward and then runs relative smoothly while driving, meanwhile pumping the clutch, but it does not run free and if I step on the brake, the engine dies...
Anyway I believe it has been rusted so solid, that not even running over bumps would do it, as I tried a few, also when it gassed the engine; it would jump forward and slowed immediately down after releasing the gas, giving it quite a shock too.

Can anybody tell me the simplest way to get to the clutch, I have a good mechanic, who for lots of money, could help ?

Appreciate any comments and help,

Thanks and regards,

Jules
Pinz of rock - 710M / 1975 (Austrian Army)
JNijst
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Re: Cannot change into gears, only with engine off ???

Post by JNijst »

I just re-read the previous comments, but did not try it in 4th gear...

I even managed to park her in rear-gear in the garage...
I will go now and try that 4-th gear!

Jules
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JNijst
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Re: Cannot change into gears, only with engine off ???

Post by JNijst »

No did not work in 4 thgear, though I managed to drive it in 4th gear, but clutch would not budge. With the clutch fully pressed in, it still did not free it and only behaved as if the clutch was released by my foot.

Oh my what is coming at me ? It is a half hour drive, through several villages and round-abouts, to this mechanic... and with the gear stuck in 4th, every time I stop I have start on the battery...

Hopefully someone has an idea ...

Thanks

Jules
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edzz
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Re: Cannot change into gears, only with engine off ???

Post by edzz »

When you are running in 4th gear have you stabbed the brake peddle with the clutch peddle pressed in?

Are you certain you have fluid in the clutch reservoir and that the clutch slave is being activated?
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JNijst
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Re: Cannot change into gears, only with engine off ???

Post by JNijst »

Hi Ed,

No; I have not stabbed the brake with the clutch pressed in, will try that after I finish this.

I have never had a problem with clutch fluid, but will check also.
How do I know if the clutch-slave is engaged ? The repair manual is tight on details, but it looks as if I need to remove the cover for clutch housing (no 16) to see if it engages ? ie that (No 5) thrust bolt and therefore N0 4 release-fork moves ?

Best regards and thanks a million for the replies !!!

Jules.

PS anybody else reading this: just in case I need to remove the clutch housing later, would it be usefull to replace parts, that usually are worn ? clutch-plate ? What are the cheapest and easiest parts to replace ?
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Pinz of rock - 710M / 1975 (Austrian Army)
JNijst
Netherlands
Posts: 123
Joined: Sat Apr 07, 2007 12:58 pm
Location: Eindhoven, Netherlands

Re: Cannot change into gears, only with engine off ???

Post by JNijst »

Unfortunately it did not work; driving in 4th gear and with the clutch fully pressed in, I braked as hard as I could. This turned the engine off, but nothing else, tried 4 times and gave up.
Checked the clutch reservoir, but is full.
At the clutch-brake box I could see the lever, that moves when you press the clutch in, move indeed. Could not check anything else, as I was on my own and could not press the clutch and simultaneously check elsewhere.

This sounds ominous and looks like a major clutch-job coming up... Any suggestions as to what to do next ?
I am planning to check this forum for clutch-jobs with pictures, but maybe extra suggestions could really help

Many thanks and regards,

Jules
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audiocontr
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Re: Cannot change into gears, only with engine off ???

Post by audiocontr »

I had to weld a small bead onto my thrust shaft as it was slightly too short. Now that its worn, I need to take a mm off
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undysworld
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Re: Cannot change into gears, only with engine off ???

Post by undysworld »

Jules,

I doubt that you need to modify the length of the clutch push rod. Things worked fine when you parked it, it hasn't changed length. You didn't mention that the clutch "feels" weird either. I suspect that you are pushing the throwout bearing down, but the clutch disc is stuck to the flywheel and/or the pressure plate so it won't release.

I realize I wasn't really clear before. I'd suggest you lay several "bumps" out in front of the truck a ways. (Could be 4x4s or tree branches, etc.) 63Rover is correct, that too low a gear will not provide enough torque, but 1st gear (Hi Range) should do. Hold the clutch down while you drive across the timbers. With the pressure off the clutch disc, the shocks of this front - back bumping may break the disc free. (Using the brakes only applies force in one direction.)

Once it breaks free, hopefully things are just fine. If this doesn't do it, I think you'll need to pull the tranny to break the disc free.

Do you own the service manuals? If not, we can give you info on pulling it out.
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I hope to die in my ski boots... ...just not today. Me
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