Air conditioning

lindenengineering · Post by **lindenengineering** » Fri Oct 05, 2007 9:56 pm

Well, guys not really spec's for Pinzies but the link shows you what we might be able to convert given time.

We are about to start fitting these to class 8 trucks take a look.
I will be posting times when we will be doing installs so folk can come by and do a touchy feely.
Dennis
The APU HQ
Golden
www.BlueCoolTruck.com
Webasto,Willis,Idle Air Solutions,Power Technologies,Comfort Air Systems. and Domenco Agents

andy · Post by **andy** » Fri Oct 05, 2007 10:28 pm

Looks like it would be cool (pun intended) in a K or even the M's that have insulated tops. Probably really nifty in the ambulance or service trucks. Good luck with it.

todds112 · Post by **todds112** » Fri Oct 05, 2007 10:58 pm

A/C?!

Who needs A/C? We are getting snow now, maybe 6-8" tonight.

Looks like an innovative system. Would be interesting to see an installation in a Pinz.

lindenengineering · Post by **lindenengineering** » Fri Oct 05, 2007 11:15 pm

Guys
If you didn't catch it it's based upon a super iced block of iced water (for want of a (better description) and air being blasted over the chiller matrix.
What's more its totally CARB compliant!

I had a call from Jeffco Police today on this product. Very nice I suppose if you are doing covert surveillance on a crack house from a van in the mid day sun.

Todd my nephew tells me all their (Londen Met) surveillance vans are equipped with this cooler in Central London. Of course it's the regular Blue Heat to keep warm with when doing the same when its peeing down & cold!
Dennis

Erik712m · Post by **Erik712m** » Fri Oct 05, 2007 11:23 pm

Requires a 165 amp alternator. only cools about 16 cubic foot not sure your going to see one in a pinz any time soon.

lindenengineering · Post by **lindenengineering** » Fri Oct 05, 2007 11:39 pm

Like I posted Eric.
Might and might is the operative word. They are used today in Euro vans
with practical success so look out!
As technology and innovation improves these novel ideas will trickle down even to those like Pinzgauers.
Dennis

Boelt63A · Post by **Boelt63A** » Sat Oct 06, 2007 6:03 pm

notice that the charts and graphs don't take into acount ambient humidity only temp. Obviously this is a good system in low humidity but in the south I don't know it will be terribly effective. The graph says Texas but where, west or east Texas? Big difference there!!

mjnims · Post by **mjnims** » Sat Oct 06, 2007 8:01 pm

I know the pinz has little power to spare but the sanden compressors have been used in small engine cars and trucks for some time. I have a few buddies with classic hot rods that use systems from www.classicair.com with great success. The systems are compact and adaptable to any type of vehicle. All that would be needed is some imagination and one of these systems should work fine. Locally here, Mark W has been running his 712 with a sanden compressor and he sure looks comfy in the summer heat of the Phoenix sun.
I look at all the vehicles with smaller engines that have air conditioning and can't help but think a conventional a/c system has to be doable in a pinz. If chevrolet can put air in their air cooled car than I am sure the pinz can handle it.
just do it

Erik712m · Post by **Erik712m** » Sat Oct 06, 2007 9:09 pm

http://www.compactappliance.com/xq/JSP. ... AP450Z.htm Allways that this would be easy to install in the back if one needed cooling while camping. I seem to take the heat better than the cold.So I think I be installing a heater instead.

Jim LaGuardia · Post by **Jim LaGuardia** » Sun Oct 07, 2007 1:15 am

You would need a double crank pulley to do it right, and that part alone is a few hundred $ at the least.
Look at some pic's of the Red Bull trucks, some of them have A/C, but it does suck a lot of power on any grade

mjnims · Post by **mjnims** » Sun Oct 07, 2007 8:13 am

Jim
I would have thought that you would have used this opportunity to push the 2.7L engine upgrade and FI system

A combination that is sure to catch on as more and more accessories become available.

M Wehrman · Post by **M Wehrman** » Sun Oct 07, 2007 1:06 pm

I find the power draw is very small w/the Sanden. All you have to do is turn off the compressor to regain the power as needed.

Mark

Jim LaGuardia · Post by **Jim LaGuardia** » Sun Oct 07, 2007 1:13 pm

Not too many guys seem interested, as it takes a fair amount of funds

I have 8 EFI base kits for those still sitting on the fence, when these sell, more can be made.
I don't believe in high pressure sales, for those interested in feeling the power of upgrading, go to Ramona Motors and test drive the upgraded tan 710M .
Be aware that even with upgrades A/C still sucks a lot of power, but it can be done $$$$$$

ScottishPinz · Post by **ScottishPinz** » Sun Oct 07, 2007 2:29 pm

The pinz had air-con as a factory option didn't it?

lindenengineering · Post by **lindenengineering** » Mon Oct 08, 2007 12:30 am

Scottish Pinz
Greetings.
As far as I see it there was an attempt to introduce A/C to the 710/712 series. Essentially the compressor was mounted on the front axle sub assy by brackets and powered by a twin row pulley. The compressor was a 5 cyl rotary. As with any conventional A/C system the power draw is likely to be about 25% of total engine torque yield when under full delivery.(i.e high head pressures equating to 350psi when using R134a ambients at (100dg F.) and utilizing the Kysor style roof mounted evap/blower down draft pack
We have used Freeze 12 as clone R12 refrigerant substition in many applications that is lighter than R134a which in practical terms means less head pressures and therefore lowers engine lug down on compress cycles.
(200 to 225 psi are typical)

You might like to know that many manufacturers in the past have put wide open throttle (WOT) cut out systems on their A/C's to limit drag. Subaru, Break My Wallet (BMW) and older Jags did this for accelaration gain. Of course these days the variable compressor has reduced this drag factor to a certain extent. We can thank GM for that with their cheap ass Harrison unit, but it works.

We have by the way used a more progressive Webasto CC4e self contained unit on a Volvo c303 cab with excellent results. The only connection the to the truck chassis was the electrical system that pulled 58A at full load dropping to a 17 amp "on cruise". All we did was to install a 75A Denso alternator to cover the load factor.
The limiting factor in this case was money; the package adds up about $5500 installed!

What disappointed me on this post originally opened by me was the seemingly lack of appreciation of the advances of technology especially that coming out of Europe. The Blue Cool unit is totally passive and is using stored energy derived from a big trucks drive cycle going from one destination to another. For info, CARB (California) mandates no commercial truck will idle within 100 yards of a housing unit not even with an ICEU APU. The Blue Cool in effect means no internal combustion engine is operating to provide the driver with hotel comforts. The next best would be a fuel cell at thousand of dollars more!
Frankly it seems operators on this side of the pond like the smell of exhaust pollutants and exhaust roar when sleeping!
The nearest unit we have fitted to big trucks that comes anywhere near it is the Domenco unit needing 8 type 31 deep cycle batteries and a 250 amp alternator. Then the max energy output can only be measured as 10,000 BTU.
All this is patently progress and we will see in the next few years some exciting changes in emissions. As you know over where you are petrol is more than a quid a litre. That in US terms is $9.00 per gallon!

I looked over a report by the PM of Qatar the other day who stated the real price of a barrel of oil should be @ $125/barrel due to the green back's decline in value worldwide. Although only representing 2% of US imports the price of oil at that level would cause Wall St to go into a 'wobble mode" if the price was to go to that overnight. I suppose the the worry threat of imminent invasion by the US is keeping it low.
So I suppose we should all look out 'cos it might end up that way soon in any case come what may.

"Pinzgauer lawn ornaments on E Bay anyone"
Dennis
The APU HQ
Golden CO